rabbitears
New Member
State: WI
This is fairly long, but should answer most questions.
I'm a free lance photographer, and I mainly shoot live performances with a photo pass.
About a month ago I saw a job offer for the photographer position at a venue. I had the idea at the time that working at this venue would help me advance in my career, so I applied and received a response that day.
The response, from the art director, gave me direct instructions on how to officially apply for the position. Including in the directions was signing a contract stating all photos taken as an employee would solely belong to the venue. I was very hesitant in signing, and when I worked at the venue two weeks later I asked for more information on the job. I was informed by a woman at the box office that my compensation would be 30 dollars for each show, and the rest of her instruction matched up with the email I received previously.
I wanted to wait on giving her the contract but she insisted that I let her hold onto it, and that I could have them tear it up if I declined the job.
The next week I phoned the director before I left to their venue, for verification on the email instructions. The first time I attempted to contact him, his assistant told me that he was currently in a meeting and to phone back in 20 minutes. After about 20 minutes I phoned again and this time was informed he was working on a project and that HE would call me back shortly.
After much debate with myself I reread his email and decided to just go to the venue like he had stated. When I had showed up for the concert that night prepared to work, there was an issue granting me the photo pass, and after an hour of waiting I was told that I had no permission to photograph the show because I hadn't arranged it with the art director prior to coming. Confused I explained what the email had told me to the employees, and asked them to please phone him again to let him know that I had driven an hour to work the show. The employee working the box office told me that the director had no idea what I was talking about and did not speak to me earlier that day.
I left the venue very frustrated with much time to think on my hour drive home. I asked myself if this confusion and miscommunication was worth working at the venue. It wasn't hard to see that for me personally, this wasn't a job that would work.
30 dollars for sole rights to 100 high quality photos is a slap in the face!
Possibly wasting a fuel, time and a night that could have been spent shooting at another venue just seemed like a pain!
AND I didn't NEED this job for the passes, or to do what I had already been doing for a long while.
On April 11th I went to the venue for a show that I had a pass for and spoke briefly to the woman at the box office. I had mentioned that I didn't feel comfortable with the venue holding the contract when I wasn't sure if I wanted to be an employee just yet. I further explained that I had done exactly what the instructions in the email had stated, and that I was bothered with what a mess that night resulted in. She asked me if I wanted to 'tear it up' and I said I mainly wanted to hold onto it, but maybe we should tear it up until I speak with the director and have more time to think about it. She then asked me to meet her after the show that night for the contract, because its current location was upstairs In a safe.
After the show was finished I quickly glanced at the box office and didn't see anyone there; I was tired and with company and decided to head home and get the contact when I got another pass at that venue.
April 18th I had been on assignment with a magazine to photograph a performance at that venue, and when I arrived to get my pass she glanced at my license and then walked away. After a few minutes of being ignored, a man pointed at me through the box office window and nodded. He disappeared for a few seconds and approached me from a side door and asked me to come with him.
My little brother had accompanied me to the show and the security guard asked him to stay back. As soon as the guy had me off to the side he said to me "You are not allowed to shoot her anymore, we don't care what list you are on. My boss informed me that you have refused to sign a contract and you are not allowed to shoot here".
I didn't even know this mans name!
After forcing an introduction I tried to clarify what exactly I had done wrong.
I clearly asked:
"So because I have refused your job offer, I am no longer allowed to shoot photos here no matter who I'm working for?"
The man told me that it had nothing to do with the declining a job offer and said I was not allowed to shoot here because I asked to void the contract, and his boss feels like there would be a hidden agenda to this.
The contract I asked to HOLD ON TO was an agreement for employment with the facility. When I briefly explained why I had declined their offer he seemed to be a little confused, but told me that his boss had final say.
He also told me that the venue was working on a contract that every photographer would sign so that they would not be legally allowed to sell their photos. For better understanding I asked him if he meant like the type of contracts the house of blues requires. He agreed and told me he wasn't sure when this contract would be done, or what exactly it would say.
I asked him if I would be allowed to photograph there if I signed that contract, and he told me that it was possible but still his boss would have final say. I asked him if at this time other photographers were allowed to photograph there, and responded with a yes.
I had offered to sign something stating that the photos were only for editorial use and he told me understandably that he was not authorized to do that. I asked him if he could contact his boss and give him more details of the situation, and he told me he 'could contact his boss whenever he wanted'.
After he called his boss the answer was still no, and he told me it would stay a no and that I needed to talk with his boss after 2pm on weekdays.
So basically if I would have never applied for the employment I could shoot there.
OR
If I would have never asked for the contract back, I could have still shoot there not as an employee but strictly on artist/media photo passes.
The guy even said because I had wanted the contract voided that his boss felt I had a hidden agenda and didn't want me shooting there.
He tried justifying the bosses' decision by telling me they have had problems with other photographers in the past so I can't shoot there?
My bottom-line
Is it lawful for them to tell me I cannot photograph shows there no matter what list or publication I'm with, because I declined there employment?
What Should I Do?
This is fairly long, but should answer most questions.
I'm a free lance photographer, and I mainly shoot live performances with a photo pass.
About a month ago I saw a job offer for the photographer position at a venue. I had the idea at the time that working at this venue would help me advance in my career, so I applied and received a response that day.
The response, from the art director, gave me direct instructions on how to officially apply for the position. Including in the directions was signing a contract stating all photos taken as an employee would solely belong to the venue. I was very hesitant in signing, and when I worked at the venue two weeks later I asked for more information on the job. I was informed by a woman at the box office that my compensation would be 30 dollars for each show, and the rest of her instruction matched up with the email I received previously.
I wanted to wait on giving her the contract but she insisted that I let her hold onto it, and that I could have them tear it up if I declined the job.
The next week I phoned the director before I left to their venue, for verification on the email instructions. The first time I attempted to contact him, his assistant told me that he was currently in a meeting and to phone back in 20 minutes. After about 20 minutes I phoned again and this time was informed he was working on a project and that HE would call me back shortly.
After much debate with myself I reread his email and decided to just go to the venue like he had stated. When I had showed up for the concert that night prepared to work, there was an issue granting me the photo pass, and after an hour of waiting I was told that I had no permission to photograph the show because I hadn't arranged it with the art director prior to coming. Confused I explained what the email had told me to the employees, and asked them to please phone him again to let him know that I had driven an hour to work the show. The employee working the box office told me that the director had no idea what I was talking about and did not speak to me earlier that day.
I left the venue very frustrated with much time to think on my hour drive home. I asked myself if this confusion and miscommunication was worth working at the venue. It wasn't hard to see that for me personally, this wasn't a job that would work.
30 dollars for sole rights to 100 high quality photos is a slap in the face!
Possibly wasting a fuel, time and a night that could have been spent shooting at another venue just seemed like a pain!
AND I didn't NEED this job for the passes, or to do what I had already been doing for a long while.
On April 11th I went to the venue for a show that I had a pass for and spoke briefly to the woman at the box office. I had mentioned that I didn't feel comfortable with the venue holding the contract when I wasn't sure if I wanted to be an employee just yet. I further explained that I had done exactly what the instructions in the email had stated, and that I was bothered with what a mess that night resulted in. She asked me if I wanted to 'tear it up' and I said I mainly wanted to hold onto it, but maybe we should tear it up until I speak with the director and have more time to think about it. She then asked me to meet her after the show that night for the contract, because its current location was upstairs In a safe.
After the show was finished I quickly glanced at the box office and didn't see anyone there; I was tired and with company and decided to head home and get the contact when I got another pass at that venue.
April 18th I had been on assignment with a magazine to photograph a performance at that venue, and when I arrived to get my pass she glanced at my license and then walked away. After a few minutes of being ignored, a man pointed at me through the box office window and nodded. He disappeared for a few seconds and approached me from a side door and asked me to come with him.
My little brother had accompanied me to the show and the security guard asked him to stay back. As soon as the guy had me off to the side he said to me "You are not allowed to shoot her anymore, we don't care what list you are on. My boss informed me that you have refused to sign a contract and you are not allowed to shoot here".
I didn't even know this mans name!
After forcing an introduction I tried to clarify what exactly I had done wrong.
I clearly asked:
"So because I have refused your job offer, I am no longer allowed to shoot photos here no matter who I'm working for?"
The man told me that it had nothing to do with the declining a job offer and said I was not allowed to shoot here because I asked to void the contract, and his boss feels like there would be a hidden agenda to this.
The contract I asked to HOLD ON TO was an agreement for employment with the facility. When I briefly explained why I had declined their offer he seemed to be a little confused, but told me that his boss had final say.
He also told me that the venue was working on a contract that every photographer would sign so that they would not be legally allowed to sell their photos. For better understanding I asked him if he meant like the type of contracts the house of blues requires. He agreed and told me he wasn't sure when this contract would be done, or what exactly it would say.
I asked him if I would be allowed to photograph there if I signed that contract, and he told me that it was possible but still his boss would have final say. I asked him if at this time other photographers were allowed to photograph there, and responded with a yes.
I had offered to sign something stating that the photos were only for editorial use and he told me understandably that he was not authorized to do that. I asked him if he could contact his boss and give him more details of the situation, and he told me he 'could contact his boss whenever he wanted'.
After he called his boss the answer was still no, and he told me it would stay a no and that I needed to talk with his boss after 2pm on weekdays.
So basically if I would have never applied for the employment I could shoot there.
OR
If I would have never asked for the contract back, I could have still shoot there not as an employee but strictly on artist/media photo passes.
The guy even said because I had wanted the contract voided that his boss felt I had a hidden agenda and didn't want me shooting there.
He tried justifying the bosses' decision by telling me they have had problems with other photographers in the past so I can't shoot there?
My bottom-line
Is it lawful for them to tell me I cannot photograph shows there no matter what list or publication I'm with, because I declined there employment?
What Should I Do?
