Shoplifting, Larceny, Robbery, Theft Bad Debt - Criminal?

[mah012]

I recently received a phone call from someone claiming to be an attorney. I believe the call is fraudulent/scam but I'm not sure.

He claims that I owe (or my social security # is tied to) an unpaid debt to a payday loan company from 2006 and that I'm being sued by the Federal Government for "theft/deception/fraud" and could face inprisonment. He had legitimate information like my social #, my bank and my father/sister names. I have never received any previous phone calls or letters stating that I have any unpaid debt.

The reason I believe the call is a scam is he could not be verified by the law firm that he claimed to work for and he continued to seek (1) my debit card information (2) my mother's maiden name (3) my DOB.

My concern is that there is a legitimate suit filed against my SS#/me and I don't know about it. It isn't showing up on my credit report but wanted to know (1) how I can check the State of California courts to find out if a suit has been filed against me and if so by who. (2) Does any of the above information sound legitimate - i.e. would the federal government sue me for an upaid debt of $1400? and (3) lastly, they asked me to send them an apology letter stating that the unpaid balance was an oversight and I intended to pay the balance in full. I did this like an idiot (I was panicked/scared). Does this serve as any real "promisary" note?

Thank you in advance.

 

[jharris352]

Ok, I was ALL WITH YOU until the last line. You sent an apology letter saying that you owed money you don't owe???? I won't beat you up over that, you already know that's very bad. Let's start at the beginning.

1. Is this a real debt? i.e. Did you take out this loan or not?

2. If you didn't who might have taken it out in your name?

3. You did WONDERFUL in not giving out any information.

4. You are probably correct that this is not an attorney. Payday loan places are NOTORIOUS for being scams.

Don't panic, don't be afraid. No one can arrest you for this. If they sue you, they have to serve you at your address. You will know because a process server or sheriff will come serve you personally.

Answer my questions and I'll help you more. RELAX.

 

[mah012]

1. No, I did not take out this loan.
2. No idea really - possibly an ex that was privy to information at the time?

And yes, I did send in a letter stating that, "I never intended to defraud any company and that IF I did owe any debt that is unpaid that I fully intended to pay in full on Oct 1, 2009 in the amount of $1489.26." I also stated that I had never received any phone calls or letters indicating that any past debt was owed.

I know this was SO STUPID but he had me convinced that he at least needed this letter in order to prevent legal action against me and I thought I was buying myself time to research what in fact this was. Believe me, I'm very angry with myself over this. I've reported them to the FTC as well.

They also told me their law firm was "Mcgougan" out of North Carolina but when I called the law firm directly, they didn't have any attorneys operating under the names that were given to me.

I just don't know what to do now if this debt isn't showing up on my credit report. Is there any other means that I have to find out if there is some pending suit against me/my social?

Also, am I now obligated to pay them since I sent in the fax?

Thank you again for your assistance.

Best regards,

 

[jharris352]

That is MUCH better than I thought it might be. Ignore these cons and yes report them to the FTC and call your State Attorney General Consumer protection division. You didn't admit to owing the debt you said, "IF" you owed the debt you would pay. MUCH BETTER. Your "social security number" can't get sued, you have to be sued. If your identity has been stolen this could be a small problem, but don't worry about being sued. Just out of a great deal of precaution I would notify the credit bureaus that your identity might have been compromised and put a fraud alert number on your credit report. This is a phone number that any potential creditor MUST call to extend you credit. You will find out if anyone is using your credit.

Next time this "attorney" calls, tell him you want his bar number and the state in which he is barred. If he refuses, tell him to pound sand and hang up. I don't exactly know what is going on, but give them NOTHING and get as much information as you can. You aren't in trouble and you sure aren't going to jail. I see two possibilities:

1. Out right con artist trying to get you to send them money.

2. Someone stole your identity. Still the "lawyer" is a con. Most likely a collector posing as an attorney.

Hey, what address did you send the letter to? What name did you send it to?

 

[mah012]

Whew! Thank you!

I will contact the credit bureaus and the atty general's office.

They had me fax them the letter to an 858 area code (I believe San Diego county) but the phone number is 310-598-1675 out of Beverly Hills, CA. But they are claiming to be part of a North Carolina based law firm.

They had me address the letter to George Miller and Allen Smith (no company name). Again, still mad at myself that red flags didn't start going off until the 2nd time I spoke to them - they just had me in such a state of panick / stress that I honestly wasn't thinking that there wasn't a company name!

The address they gave me is 130 Jefferson St. PO Box 1319, White Plains, NC 28472. Except for the PO Box, everything matches to this other law firm but the law firm indicated that these people didn't work there.

Thank you again for all your assistance! It is greatly appreciated.

 

[jharris352]

I would think the Law firm should also start an investigation into who is using their company name. Call that firm, talk to the Senior partner and alert him that his firm name is being used in a scam. Give him that information about the address and phone number and they should take some measures to make sure this isn't going on in their name. Tell them politely that you think they are innocent parties so you decided to give them the opportunity to take care of these people instead of you filing a bar complaint against their firm. Emphasize that you want to work with them and you aren't threatening them, but you also are not willing to be terrorized by these guys who are using their firm's name.

They will take these jokers apart believe me.

 

[jharris352]

Hey I googled the phone number you had and got this:

This scam has been going on for well over a year, now and has been recognized as such by the BBB:

Chicago, IL – August 5, 2009 – The Better Business Bureau is issuing an alert about phony debt collectors that are calling consumers nationwide and claiming that they have defaulted on a payday loan and will be arrested if they don't pay immediately. Claiming to be lawyers, the scammers say they are with the "Financial Accountability Association" or the "Federal Legislation of Unsecured Loans" and are equipped with a disconcerting amount of personal information about their potential victims.

"Because the scammers have so much information about potential victims, the BBB is concerned that this may be the result of a data breach," said Steve J. Bernas, president & CEO of the Better Business Bureau serving Chicago and Northern Illinois. "Thousands of people may have had their personal information compromised, and given the scammers' tactics, it appears that those who have previously used payday loan services could be particularly at risk."

According to reports received by the BBB and posted online, the scammers accuse the victim of defaulting on a payday loan and claim they are being sued. The phony debt collector threatens that, if the victim doesn't pay as much as $1,000 immediately via wire or by providing bank account or credit card numbers, he or she will be arrested and extradited to California within the hour to stand trial. The scammers often may have the victim's Social Security, old bank account numbers or driver's license numbers as well as home addresses, employer information and even the names of personal friends and professional references.

The BBB offers the following advice to consumers if they receive a suspicious telephone call about an outstanding debt:
* Ask the debt collector to provide official documentation in writing which substantiates the debt.
* Do not provide or confirm any bank account, credit card or other personal information over the phone until you have confirmed the legitimacy of the call.
* Review recent copies of your credit reports to ensure that the alleged debt is not affecting your credit. Consumers can do this for free once every 12 months, and can find more information here: http://www.ftc.gov/freereports
* Under the Federal Trade Commission's Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, debt collectors may not harass, oppress, or abuse any person while attempting to collect a debt.
* A debtor may be contacted between 8 a.m. and 9 p.m. only and can be contacted at work unless instructed not to.
* File a complaint with the FTC online if the caller is abusive, uses threats or otherwise violates federal telemarketing laws.
* File a complaint with BBB online at www.bbb.org if you believe a debt collector is trying to scam you.

http://www.thinkglink.com/article/2009/08/06/ ... eading-says-bbb

http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-214-618-5897

This is a very active group of scammers, many of whom are calling from India (and probably other countries) and are in cahoots with a group of American pay day loan scammers. They attempt to extort money from consumers with a myriad of false and illegal threats, and alternately pose as debt collectors, federal and state law enforcement officers, lawyers and bankers. Their trademark is to use meaningless legalese gobblygook phrases like "We are downloading warrants against you" or "We are filing an affidavit against you." Another trademark phrase is to threaten the consumer with something like this ridiculous phrase: "If you don't pay then only God can help you."

Typical of many financial scams of this variety, they usually demand payment via Western Union or MoneyGram or credit card. They use any number of phony names such as US National Bank, Federal Investigation Bureau, US Legal Investigation Bureau, Hopkins Law Office, United Legal Processing, Morgan Associates, United Pay Services, National Processing, White Collar Crime Unit and many more. These criminals also use many phone numbers from many area codes; they're probably using caller-id spoofing software and/or VoIP to disguise their real location.

The main thing to remember is that anytime someone calls you demanding money to prevent your arrest, or demanding your lawyer's name so they can sue you, it is ALWAYS a scam. No debt collector (let alone criminals posing as debt collectors) has the authority to have anyone arrested for anything. (And it's illegal to them to threaten such a thing.) And since these foreign dirtbags routinely impersonate law enforcement, it's also important to remember that American law enforcement officers aren't in the business of debt collection. (Debt is a civil, not a criminal, matter.)

The bottom line is, these are criminals trying to steal your money.

A consumer posting a complaint about these same scammers at http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-718-831-7157 notes that 718-831-7157 is associated with an India-based "outsourcing" telephone bank. Though a reverse search on WhitePages.com shows that 718-831-7157 is an unlisted land line in New York City, information on Debtbuyers.Com shows that that number is used by India-based Intellisourze. (Source: http://www.debtbuyers.com/debtbuyers.asp ) My guess is that it's a VoIP phone number.

This is another piece of the puzzle that fits in perfectly with other information about this scam. There are some reports on 800Notes that have suggested that the crooks behind this offshore scam are also the crooks behind the notorious Bass/Ellis Crosby & Assoc./States Predisposition scams in Florida and Georgia. The interesting thing is that the number of complaints on here about the US National Bank/US Legal Investigation/Federal Investigation scam skyrocketed *after* April 7, 2008 when Florida obtained a $1.3 million judgment against Ted Ellis Crosby, shutdown his operations and barred him from ever conducting debt collections in Florida (Read http://myfloridalegal.com/newsrel.nsf/newsrel ... 5257424005858A6 ) There's certainly a good chance that the crooks placing these calls from India are doing so on behalf of the American crooks behind the Crosby/Bass/States Predisposition scams.

Here's the contact information for the phone bank in India:

IntellisOurzE BPO
701, Sapphier, Nr. Cargo Motors,
C.G. Road Navrangpura,
Ahmedabad - 9. (Guj.) INDIA.
E-Mail: info@intellisourze.com
Website: www.intellisourze.com

A check on the domain name "intellisourze.com" shows that the website and name registration was created on May 8, just one month *after* the Crosby scams were shut down in Florida:

Domain Name: INTELLISOURZE.COM
Registrant: Pragra Infratech Pvt. Limited.
Email: ankur.ranpariya@pragra.com
908, Aksaht Tower, Nr. ICICI Bank
Opp. Rajpath Club, S.G. Highway
Ahmedabad, Gujarat, India 380054
Tel. +91.7926871353
Creation Date: 08-May-2008
Expiration Date: 08-May-2009
Domain servers in listed order: ns5.znetindia.com ns4.znetindia.com
(Source: http://whois.domaintools.com/intellisourze.com )

Though scam calls from these crooks have been going on long before May 8, the frequency of complaints about these calls increased considerably after Crosby was shut down in early April.

This is conjecture, but appearances suggest that Crosby and company were originally running a two-pronged payday loan scam operation -- with some calls being made from Jacksonville, Florida and other calls being made from a phone bank in India (and possibly other countries); then, after the Florida Attorney General shut down the Crosby scams in Florida, the Crosby crooks transferred most of their scam efforts to the India phone bank.

If you are targeted by these criminals, be sure to report them to all the following federal and state law enforcement agencies (most of which you can do online or over the phone):

1) Alert the FBI at https://tips.fbi.gov Be sure to tell the FBI that you are being targeted by extortionists over the phone. And if the crooks claim to be law enforcement, lawyers, officers of the court or bankers, or if they threatened you with arrest, be sure to include that information in your report.

2) File a complaint online with The Federal Trade Commission at https://www.ftccomplaintassistant.gov/FTC_Wizard.aspx?Lang=en

3) File a complaint with your local police. Most police departments will take a report over the phone. Be sure to tell them that you're being targeted by an extortionist and give them all the details.

4) The caller placed the call under a Texas area code. Even though the caller ID was probably spoofed or they're using VoIP technology to hide the fact that they're really calling from overseas, you should also file a complaint with the Texas Attorney General at http://www.oag.state.tx.us/consumer/complain.shtml

5) File a complaint your state's attorney general, the contact information for whom is at www.naag.org

6) The U.S. Secret Service is responsible for protecting the country's financial infrastructure and payment systems from international and domestic threats. Call or write your local Secret Service field office to alert them to the details of this attempted extortion. The addresses and phone numbers for the local Secret Service field offices are listed at http://www.secretservice.gov/field_offices.shtml or in your phone book.

If these crooks call back, promise them nothing, pay them nothing and tell them nothing other than that you know they're a scam and that you've reported them to law enforcement. (And be sure to report them to all the agencies above each time they call you.)

By the way, here's just a small sample of numbers used by this particular group of scammers. Read the reports and you'll see the same pattern time and again -- phony organization names, thick foreign accents, and oddly worded threats that are so melodramatic and ridiculous that it's laughable:

http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-925-262-1327
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-678-954-6346
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-888-341-4004
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-856-831-0640
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-949-743-1140
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-410-505-8128
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-917-464-2534
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-210-858-6602
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-888-775-2121
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-949-743-1156
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-214-245-1402
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-214-245-0922
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-214-723-5572
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-904-425-2863
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-718-831-7157
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-904-425-2857
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-858-244-0444
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-954-678-9724
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-610-571-3252
http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-310-909-8245

...and, many, MANY more.
Caller ID: 310-598-1675
Caller: MANY Aliases
Caller Type: Collection Agency

 

[raskalnikov]

Good research job, JHarris!

 

[mah012]

Wow! Amazing and quite helpful information. I have checked my credit reports and filed a "fraud alert" on all of them. Have also filed claims w/ the FBI, FTC and Atty General. I will follow up with the Law Firm and also notify the BBB.

Thank you again! I can't express how grateful I am for your thoughts/input.