Can I get Explungement?

[Layton78]

Jurisdiction

California

Hello,

I have a unique situation. I have never been in trouble in my life. I followed a friend like a dummy and recieved a felony in Orange County, CA for FORGERY. I would love expungement to get my gun rights back....Here is the main bullet points:

1. Over 5 years since my conviction
2. I only did County jail time. No Prison, no parole or probation
3. Paid off all fines EXCEPT my restitution (300k)
4. I currently live in Washington State

The confusing part is.....the company I owe restitution to has never in 5 years asked me for any money. They have never garnished my wages. NOTHING. Is this normal?

Should I contact the company I owe money to and ask if they will drop the restitution?
Should I just leave it alone for the rest of my life and just accept Ill never have my gun rights returned?

I have contacted some companies that deal with getting expungements but they just say I have to pay restitution in full which I will never do obviously. But, they dont understand why I have never been approached for the money.

Would love ANYYY help, direction or info!

 

[justblue]

Hello,

I have a unique situation. I have never been in trouble in my life. I followed a friend like a dummy and recieved a felony in Orange County, CA for FORGERY. I would love expungement to get my gun rights back....Here is the main bullet points:

1. Over 5 years since my conviction
2. I only did County jail time. No Prison, no parole or probation
3. Paid off all fines EXCEPT my restitution (300k)
4. I currently live in Washington State

The confusing part is.....the company I owe restitution to has never in 5 years asked me for any money. They have never garnished my wages. NOTHING. Is this normal?

Should I contact the company I owe money to and ask if they will drop the restitution?
Should I just leave it alone for the rest of my life and just accept Ill never have my gun rights returned?

I have contacted some companies that deal with getting expungements but they just say I have to pay restitution in full which I will never do obviously. But, they dont understand why I have never been approached for the money.

Would love ANYYY help, direction or info!

What exactly were you convicted of?

I highly suggest you seek a consult (in person) with a Crimial Defense Attorney...Restitution is court ORDERED. You may be looking at prison time for not paying your COURT ORDERED restitution.

 

[adjusterjack]

The confusing part is.....the company I owe restitution to has never in 5 years asked me for any money. They have never garnished my wages. NOTHING. Is this normal?

Seriously?

You knew how much you had to pay 5 years ago. Nobody had to ask you for it. You could have had it paid off by now.

I have contacted some companies that deal with getting expungements but they just say I have to pay restitution in full which I will never do obviously.

Never pay, never have gun rights.

Would love ANYYY help, direction or info!

Pay the restitution. Make small payments out of each paycheck. They aren't going to turn it down. Maybe in another 5 years you'll have it all paid off and can revisit expungement.

 

[Zigner]

Why do you believe an expungement would reinstate your gun rights?

 

[flyingron]

There's no such thing as outright expungement in California. 1203.4 allows you to set aside certain convictions (though their record remains), as Zigner points out it does not allow you to possess firearms, hold public office, etc... It also doesn't remove the obligation to report this on people entitled to ask about this (essentially, applying for public jobs or licenses).

Further, a 1203.4 set aside is not going to get you out of the restitution requirements in most cases.

 

[Zigner]

There's no such thing as outright expungement in California. 1203.4 allows you to set aside certain convictions (though their record remains), as Zigner points out it does not allow you to possess firearms, hold public office, etc... It also doesn't remove the obligation to report this on people entitled to ask about this (essentially, applying for public jobs or licenses).

Further, a 1203.4 set aside is not going to get you out of the restitution requirements in most cases.

Two things: It appears that Washington State *might* allow an expungement in this case to restore gun rights, but I'm not sure. The OP should be speaking to an attorney about that.
As for the restitution: I don't believe that an expungement is possible in the first place without the restitution being paid.

 

[army judge]

People are often misinformed.

An expungement/expunction is often confused with a pardon.

Pardons are rare.

Pardons are difficult to obtain.

My admonishment is always be proactive in order to not become reactive.

Obey society's laws, all of it's laws.

Do that, you need not worry about an expungement or a pardon.

What is "expungement?"
It is not uncommon among juvenile court proceedings to encounter the term "expungement," or find an expungement order issued by the court. What does it mean? Here, Teaching Legal Docs will explore an expungement order, and try to place the document in a larger context of law and culture.

To "expunge" is to "erase or remove completely." In law, "expungement" is the process by which a record of criminal conviction is destroyed or sealed from state or federal record. An expungement order directs the court to treat the criminal conviction as if it had never occurred, essentially removing it from a defendant's criminal record as well as, ideally, the public record.

It is important to clarify that expungement is not "forgiveness" for committing a crime—that is a legal pardon. Likewise, pardons are not expungements and do not require removal of a conviction from a criminal record. In the United States, pardons may be granted by public officials. The President, for example, issues pardons annually. State governors may also pardon certain defendants in their states. Expungement proceedings, however, must be ordered by a judge, or court.

A State Affair
In the United States, virtually all expungement proceedings take place in state courts. Expungement orders from federal courts are extremely rare, and there is no federal statute governing its application at the federal level. Each state, however, has its own laws about whose records are eligible for expungement, which offenses may be expunged, procedures for application, and definitions of how records will be managed under an expungement order. Juvenile records are the most common, but many states also allow adult defendants to seek expungement of their records. In Kentucky, for example, an adult may petition the court for expungement of certain records. Maine and North Dakota, however, limit expungements to juveniles and other specific defendants. All states limit the types of offenses that may be expunged. Driving offenses, for example, may not be expunged from records in some states. Other serious offenses, including murder, kidnapping, and rape, may also be ineligible for expungement. Once a record is ordered by a court to be expunged, states then have laws about how the record is to be handled, typically sealed (Kentucky, for example) or destroyed (Washington). If a record is sealed, it may remain available to law enforcement officers, but removed from the public. If a record is destroyed, all relevant documentation is removed from the state court system following the state's protocols for records destruction.

The example expungement order documents in this Teaching Legal Docs were issued by the Family Court of South Carolina and the Allegheny County Court in Pennsylvania. The documents complement one another by providing two important pieces of the expungement action—case information (South Carolina) and the actual expungement order from the court (Pennsylvania).
Both documents clearly indicate, with titles, that they are orders for expungement. An expungement order will typically identify a case, the parties involved, and the matter to be expunged from the court record. The South Carolina example includes entries for all of this information. If we consider this document alongside the document from Pennsylvania, we might get a sense of how the court order for expungement is actually carried out. The order lists eight different agencies within the Allegheny County court system that are to receive a copy of the order, with instructions to "expunge and destroy the official and unofficial arrest, expungement, and other documents" pertaining to the referenced criminal proceedings. It includes a date and state seal, which certify its filing with the court. The order is signed by a judge, who also wrote "By The Court" in script to indicate the court's directive. Finally, at the bottom of the order, there is an "Affidavit of Expungement," by which the person signing certifies that the indicated records "have been expunged and destroyed" as directed.

There are Limits
An expungement order concerns specific matters and specific courts, and nothing more. Expungement orders do not remove records from the press, Google, or social media, for example. It depends on the matter that is being expunged, but sometimes additional documentation about the matter exists outside of the court's jurisdiction. Without additional legal actions, the court cannot expunge such things as news stories, social media posts, interviews, or, in some cases, arrest reports made by police departments outside the court's purview. Basically, expungement orders cannot completely erase public record. A recent federal court decision from the Tenth Circuit, Nilson v. Layton City, explains:

An expungement order does not privatize criminal activity. While it removes a particular arrest and/or conviction from an individual criminal record, the underlying object of expungement remains public. Court records and police blotters permanently document the expunged incident, and those officials integrally involved retain knowledge of the event. An expunged arrest and/or conviction is never truly removed from the public record and thus is not entitled to privacy protection.

So, while a person's reasons for seeking expungement of a record, and a court's reason for allowing expungement of a record, might, ultimately, include desires for privacy, it is important to realize that there are limitations. Courts are working daily to strike a balance between public record and expunged matter in today's Information Age.

What Is "Expungement?"
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What is a Pardon
A pardon is an official forgiveness, or release from liability for a criminal offense. Once granted, a pardon eliminates the punishment handed down by the court, though it normally does not affect any prison time already served. A pardon also makes it possible for the pardoned individual to clear his name in whatever consequences may occur as a result of the criminal charges. It does not, however, wipe out the fact that the individual was guilty, or expunge the crime from the individual's criminal record. While a pardon may be granted at the discretion of the President and state governors, it is not a constitutional right afforded to citizens of the United States.

Types of Pardon
There are different types of pardons that may be granted, both at the federal and state level. The type used depends on the circumstances surrounding the issue. The four primary types of pardon include:

Full – absolves an individual of the conviction and all consequences of the crime, unconditionally.
Absolute – absolution granted to an individual without any conditions.
Partial – absolves an individual from only part of the punishment or consequences of the crime for which he was convicted.
Conditional – given with certain specific conditions that must be fulfilled by the individual seeking the pardon, before the pardon would go into effect. Other conditions may include conditions or acts after the pardon is granted in order to keep the pardon from becoming void.

https://legaldictionary.net/pardon/
...

 

[flyingron]

Washington can't expunge California convictions.

However, I did miss that he lives in Washington State. Washington State equates forgery from out of state as.a class C felony, which means he is eligible for gun rights restoration five years after he is RELEASED from jail. Probation doesn't enter into it.

The sticky part is that if he is that given he's a prohibited person in California, he still is likely federally barred as well. He's probably going to have to wait ten years and apply to the courts in California for that relief.

 

[army judge]

Should I just leave it alone for the rest of my life and just accept Ill never have my gun rights returned?

Therein lies the rub, mate.


An alleged state restoration of your right to keep and bear arms is a meaningless gesture.

Why?

The federales own the 2nd amendment issue, as do they with all other constitutional issues and challenges.

Even if one of our 50 states expunged your felony conviction, it becomes a meaningless gesture.

If you wish to purchase a firearm, you'd have to clear the FBI background check. Sure, the Sovereign State of Confusion expunged your conviction, but the FBI still possesses your booking mugshot, fingerprints, maybe your DNA, details of your arrest and conviction.

In addition, you're required to complete a form. One of the form's questions asks if you've ever been convicted of a felony. Again, contradicting what you believed had been expunged.

Politicians are discussing a way to change what it is today, while others want more stringent gun control measures.

I advise people in your position to just forget about owning a firearm, until the problems with the system are addressed to allow you what you desire with certainty, not maybe.



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