Shoplifting, Larceny, Robbery, Theft I'm wanting to know my rights...

[katie128]

Ok so here's the deal. I was friends with a married couple. They added me onto their cell phone plan in exchange for me to pay them a monthly fee for using it. Within two days they shut off my phone reporting it lost or stolen. Apparently they thought I called family services on them in which I did NOT. When I went to their house to tell them this they had it turned back on pretending not to know why the phone was deactivated. That night the wife spazzed out on me and told me not to come back in her house because I didn't wash a dish after dinner. (I'm thinking they both have some serious mental issues) That night she wouldn't stop text messaging me on the phone that they had *given* me. They were insulting and downright unfounded. Finally I had enough and threw the phone in the toilet. First of all you have to understand that I have bipolar disorder and borderline personality disorder to the point I'm on disability for it. After that I went to pick my boyfriend up on his lunch break and proceeded to throw it out the window of my moving car while I was driving. So the phone is long gone. What the problem is they apparently got their kids taken away so they got mad at me again and called the police reporting their phone stolen. First of all we had a verbal agreement that the phone was mine as long as I paid for it and I haven't even had the chance to pay for it since I haven't had it long enough. So the police came to my apartment last night and said I had until 6 pm tonight to return the phone and "more and likely wouldn't face any charges" as long as I returned the phone. Well of course that's not an option and even if it was all they have to say is that they never got the phone back and it's their word against mine.

So what do I do? I told the police that I gave it to a friend to give back to them and that is the last time I saw it. My friend says she's going to vouch for me and just say she left it on their porch since they weren't home and don't know where it went from there. Do the police have a right to arrest me because they were told I had a phone even though it's not in my possession now? What should I do? Something is telling me that they would have to take me to small claims court and prove that I had the phone in the first place and that they never got it back. The service has been deactivated and I have a prepaid cell phone so I could easily say that I would have no use for a phone that the service had been cut off to. So anyway what should I do? Do I need to get an attorney? I'm stressing out about this. Please help. Oh and if the police should return what should or shouldn't I say to them? Do I have to even answer the door?

 

[CdwJava]

Ok so here's the deal. I was friends with a married couple. They added me onto their cell phone plan in exchange for me to pay them a monthly fee for using it.

Wouldn't it have been easier to just get your OWN plan?

This just sounds ... weird.

When I went to their house to tell them this they had it turned back on pretending not to know why the phone was deactivated. That night the wife spazzed out on me and told me not to come back in her house because I didn't wash a dish after dinner. (I'm thinking they both have some serious mental issues)

Sounds like a great reason to leave the phone on the counter and say "Bye."

What the problem is they apparently got their kids taken away so they got mad at me again and called the police reporting their phone stolen.

Well, it would appear to be their phone ... at least on paper. Thus, you COULD be considered to have embezzled it. It really wasn't yours to destroy.

First of all we had a verbal agreement that the phone was mine as long as I paid for it and I haven't even had the chance to pay for it since I haven't had it long enough.

Bad, bad news ... no payments, no proof of this verbal contract.

So the police came to my apartment last night and said I had until 6 pm tonight to return the phone and "more and likely wouldn't face any charges" as long as I returned the phone. Well of course that's not an option and even if it was all they have to say is that they never got the phone back and it's their word against mine.

Well, THEY have a contract from the company saying that the phone is theirs ... what do YOU have?

So what do I do? I told the police that I gave it to a friend to give back to them and that is the last time I saw it. My friend says she's going to vouch for me and just say she left it on their porch since they weren't home and don't know where it went from there.

Wow! Your friend is willing to commit perjury and go to jail for you? What a great friend!

YOU are responsible for the phone. You CAN be charged with theft or embezzlement (as appropriate under your state's laws) though I suspect that everyone will be satisfied if you simply come up with the cost of a replacement phone (which could be as high as $300 depending on the phone).

Do the police have a right to arrest me because they were told I had a phone even though it's not in my possession now? What should I do?

Compensate the other people for the phone or consult an attorney in anticipation of being charged for a crime.

Oh and if the police should return what should or shouldn't I say to them? Do I have to even answer the door?

You can ignore them if you want. But, that won't prevent criminal charges, it will only delay the inevitable.

If it were me, I'd look at making the other people "whole" by buying a replacement phone for them. The police and the court REALLY don't want to waste time with this matter, so I suspect that if the victims say they are satisfied, then the matter will go away. if you delay, you may well be arrested.

- Carl

 

[katie128]

I'm not saying what I did was right. But I'm not even going to go into the whole story about all that I have done for them and all the money I have spent on them and their family to bail them out of trouble several times and just to be nice. Yes it is my fault for being a moron and letting them take advantage of me. It would appear in this thread that they are the victims and maybe in this particular tiny part of the story they are. We all make stupid impulse decisons that sometimes have big consequences.

With that aside what's to say if I handed them their phone right now (Which of course is not an option just a senrio) they could still tell the police I never gave it to them? It goes back to my word against theirs. I'm not saying I won't compensate them. I'm just saying that no matter what I do these trash people can say I never did anything. There was a witness to them giving me the phone and the verbal agreement and that was at the cell phone place. They never once asked for their phone back. They just sent the police. I just think that after all the money I've forked over for them (By the way it would cost $50 for a replacement)I think it should be considered even. We are talking hundreds of dollars here. Yes I was stupid to be nice to them in their time of need and after when she spazzed out on me I guess I had reached my breaking point. You can't tell me that you haven't done something stupid no matter how small it is and later thought "Why in the hell did I do that? I guess I just reached my breaking point" Even if it was just an argument that you didn't mean to get into.

At any rate I'm not here to debate whether or not I did something wrong and should compensate. I posted this for help and if you don't want to do so then why reply?

 

[CdwJava]

It would appear in this thread that they are the victims and maybe in this particular tiny part of the story they are. We all make stupid impulse decisons that sometimes have big consequences.

Under the law, it would appear that they owned the phone and that you refused to give it back or destroyed property that was not yours to dispose of. That makes them the victims.

Now, you can always raise your verbal civil contract as a defense, but since you have not even paid a penny to them, it would seem that this defense would fall flat.

With that aside what's to say if I handed them their phone right now (Which of course is not an option just a senrio) they could still tell the police I never gave it to them?

Sure they could. But, since it's not a possible scenario, what's the point?

It goes back to my word against theirs.

You have no proof you gave it back ... they have proof they paid for the phone, and, I suspect, that you made or received calls on the phone (the phone bill). The weight of the state's case is going to be greater than your empty claim. But, if they are inarticulate and poor witnesses, and you can blow smoke up the court's tail end while risking a serious jail stay for perjury, go ahead and give it a go ... do you feel lucky?

I'm not saying I won't compensate them. I'm just saying that no matter what I do these trash people can say I never did anything.

Then offer to replace the phone. Go with them and a witness to the store and pay for it ... there will be proof of the payment through your credit card or canceled check AND your witness. They will be made whole, and you can probably put this behind you.

I just think that after all the money I've forked over for them (By the way it would cost $50 for a replacement)I think it should be considered even.

You can talk to them about it, but that's not how it works.

And it would cost $50 to replace the phone?? What phone company is that?! You can usually get those deals for the original phone with a new plan, but when replacing the phone usually costs far more than that (I know, I've had to do that a couple times because of kids' broken phones that were not covered by insurance).

You can take them to small claims court for what you think they owe you. But, such a claim will likely be seen as retaliation and will also just as likely be considered a gift. But, you can try.

You can't tell me that you haven't done something stupid no matter how small it is and later thought "Why in the hell did I do that? I guess I just reached my breaking point" Even if it was just an argument that you didn't mean to get into.

Sure. But, I've never had the cops called on me for it. And if I broke their phone, I'd pay them for it.

At any rate I'm not here to debate whether or not I did something wrong and should compensate. I posted this for help and if you don't want to do so then why reply?

Your legal options were provided. The possible courses of action were also mentioned. If you want someone to wave a pennant saying you were right, how would that be useful? Such a cheerleading section would do NOTHING to resolve your conundrum.

To summarize, you can seek to make the "victim" whole and ask they intercede with the police, or you can wait to be charged and hire an attorney to make a defense of it (you got about $1,500-$2,500 sitting around?). You may also get lucky and may never BE charged. The police may decide this is a civil matter and wash their hands of it - especially if you tell them about the verbal contract. But, you broke it, you owe them to replace the phone - whether it is $50 or $300.

- Carl

 

[katie128]

When I had my own cell phone plan through AT&T it was $50 to replace also (They have insurance on the phone) Their plan is through US Cellular. She won't even answer her phone to talk to me about this. She never has said anything to me since that day she spazzed out on me. It would seem to me that if someone wanted their property back they would immediately say "I changed my mind about you using my phone and want it back" I know at least I would. To answer your question about why I don't just get my own plan. I did have one once and maintained it very, paying it on time every month for two years. I trust the wrong person and he ran my bill up to nearly $1,000. Online I could view some of the charges before the bill was due. I saw that he was running up my bill (I had no idea how much at that point) and I had the phone shut off immediately. Come to find out he was running from the law. I called the half way house he was living at and asked about his "pass" to go out. They told me he had no such pass and I told them all the info I knew to find him. (He is currently in prison for the orginal charge plus running from the police) So my point is that I am not anywhere close to the person he is and I didn't run their bill up and they had no right to treat me the way they have. Lesson learnt.

I understand your point of view from the legal stand-point and will attempt to do the right thing. I think it's a good idea to do like you said to have witnesses and proof that I paid for the replacement when I do. The way it usually works is they send the phone through UPS or Fed Ex within a day or two and it's billed to them. So a money order would probably be the best way to pay them since it's sent to them in the mail. That way they wouldn't have my routing numbers from my checking account and all of that info. I have ignored the fact that these people are criminals and are barely above cock roaches. Obviously anybody that would have their kids taken away because they failed to provide them with hot water for baths, Electricity, and gas to cook on the stove, not to mention neglect in other areas (i.e. not changing the kids' diapers, etc.) and abuse are not the type of people I should be subject myself and my family to. Anybody that would take advantage of me like they have are not any friends to begin with. So you can see why I am reluctant to have anything to do with them. If they won't answer my calls or voicemails then I guess my hands are tied. I'm not going to hold them down and force a money order down their throat. Obviously they don't want money or their phone too bad if they won't even talk to me to work things out. If I were them I would try not to make too many waves being that the husband was just arrested a couple days ago for not appearing in court for bad checks over $500. (I did not know any of this until all of this started unraveling) and they just got their kids taken away. I would be more focused on getting my electric and everything turned on and getting my kids back.

So anyway thanks for your advice and I will try to see what I can do but my hands are tied at the moment.

 

[CdwJava]

When I had my own cell phone plan through AT&T it was $50 to replace also (They have insurance on the phone)

Yes, but you intentionally destroyed it ... and to say otherwise is to commit perjury or at least fraud. Check ... the insurance almost certainly does NOT cover intentional destruction. I suspect it is through Asurion ... it won't cover intentionally destroyed property.

The way it usually works is they send the phone through UPS or Fed Ex within a day or two and it's billed to them. So a money order would probably be the best way to pay them since it's sent to them in the mail. That way they wouldn't have my routing numbers from my checking account and all of that info.

That probably would work just fine.

If I were them I would try not to make too many waves being that the husband was just arrested a couple days ago for not appearing in court for bad checks over $500.

Well, the case may get a life of its own unless the DA decides it is a civil matter and declines to pursue it. Perhaps all you can do now is sit back and wait to see if the police DO file charges with the DA and see if the DA actually pursues them.

- Carl