Probate OR?

[CADavid]

Jurisdiction

Colorado

Grandfather died with trust.
Also had stock accounts for grandchildren with him as custodian and the kids names.
The trust is straight forward but because he is personally the custodian (not the trust) my understanding is the trust has no interest in these accounts.
Will we have to go to probate?
If so - how complicated might it be. Other 'heirs' involved?
Thanks

 

[adjusterjack]

Not enough information by a longshot.

Was he married at the time of his death?
How many adult children did he have?
How many grandchildren?
Their ages of the grandchildren?
How much money in the accounts?
Did he leave a will in addition to the trust?
If he left a will did he nominate someone as executor or representative of the estate?
If yes, who?
If he left a will, was it a "pour over" will?
Who is trustee of the trust?
What assets are owned by the trust?
How much is the trust worth?

So, yeah, it's likely to be complicated.
In the interest of privacy you probably shouldn't answer those questions on the internet.
I posted them to illustrate some of the information that a lawyer will probably want.

 

[CADavid]

I could answer all those questions except I don't know what a pour over will is.
But, I understand everything going on with the trust.
What I wonder is about the UTMA (CO) where grandfather is personally custodian (not the trust). As this is outside the trust, what happens now?
Thank you

 

[adjusterjack]

I don't know what a pour over will is.

Pour over will.

Understanding Pour-Over Wills: How They Integrate With Trusts

Discover how pour-over wills transfer remaining estate assets to trusts, ensuring smooth distribution while providing probate protection and fulfilling the grantor's wishes.

www.investopedia.com

What I wonder is about the UTMA (CO) where grandfather is personally custodian (not the trust). As this is outside the trust, what happens now?

See CO Statute 11-50-119(4). Addresses death of the custodian.

C.R.S. 11-50-119 – Renunciation, resignation, death, or removal of custodian

A person nominated under section 11-50-104 or designated under section 11-50-110 as custodian may decline to serve by delivering a valid disclaimer…

colorado.public.law

Here's the complete UTMA law:

C.R.S. Title 11 Article 50 – Colorado Uniform Transfers to Minors Act

Colorado Revised Statutes Title 11, Financial Institutions; Division , Securities; Subdivision , Fiduciaries and Trusts; Article 50, Colorado Uniform Transfe...

colorado.public.law

As for taxes, probate, etc - that's something to discuss with appropriate experts.

 

[zddoodah]

Also had stock accounts for grandchildren with him as custodian and the kids names.

I assume this means that your grandfather owned one or more brokerage accounts and that each of those accounts designated one or more of his grandchildren as beneficiary. Correct?

The trust is straight forward but because he is personally the custodian (not the trust)

Just FYI, a trust has a settlor/trustor/grantor (the person who created the trust), a trustee (the person who manages the trust's assets) and a beneficiary (the person for whose benefit the trust exists). I assume you meant that your grandfather was the trustee. Obviously, he no longer is.

Will we have to go to probate?

I'm not sure who "we" are. You don't have any obligation to do anything. If you are a designated beneficiary on one or more of your grandfather's brokerage accounts, then, in order to claim ownership of the account(s), you'll need to provide the broker with your grandfather's death certificate and probably fill out some forms.

Whether it will be necessary to probate your grandfather's estate is impossible to know based on the information you provided. I'm not sure why you ignored most of "adjusterjack's" questions, but answers to the following questions can help determine whether or not probate is necessary:

1. Did your grandfather have a will? If so, what does it say about who gets what? A "pour over will" is a will that leaves one's entire estate to a trust.

2. Was your grandfather married at the time of his death? If so, to what extent is his widow connected to the trust?

3. Obviously, one of your grandfather's children is your mother or father. Is your parent who is your grandfather's child still alive?

4. You mentioned "grandchildren" (plural). Are the other grandchildren your siblings, your cousins, or some of both? If any are cousins, are their parents who are children of your grandfather still alive?

5. What is the approximate value of your grandfather's assets, excluding assets that fall into one of the following categories: (a) are jointly owned with another person with the right of survivorship; (b) are owned through a trust; or (c) are held in an account that designates a pay-on-death beneficiary?

Whoever is now the trustee of your grandfather's trust would be well-advised to consult with a local probate/trust attorney.