What's a "Motion For Discovery" look like?

[Scooterdog]

(8) A party may waive the right to discovery of an item, or to discovery of the item within the time provided in this Rule. The parties may agree to reduce or enlarge the items subject to discovery pursuant to subsections (a)(1)(A) and (a)(1)(B). Any such waiver or agreement shall be in writing and signed by the waiving party or the parties to the agreement, shall identify the specific items included, and shall be served upon all the parties.

(b) Special Procedures.

(1) Notice of Alibi.

(A) Notice by Defendant. The judge may, upon written motion of the Commonwealth filed pursuant to subdivision (a)(2) of this rule, stating the time, date, and place at which the alleged offense was committed, order that the defendant serve upon the prosecutor a written notice, signed by the defendant, of his or her intention to offer a defense of alibi. The notice by the defendant shall state the specific place or places at which the defendant claims to have been at the time of the alleged offense and the names and addresses of the witnesses upon whom the defense intends to rely to establish the alibi

.
(B) Disclosure of Information and Witness. Within seven days of service of the defendant's notice of alibi, the Commonwealth shall serve upon the defendant a written notice stating the names and addresses of witnesses upon whom the prosecutor intends to rely to establish the defendant's presence at the scene of the alleged offense and any other witnesses to be relied on to rebut testimony of any of the defendant's alibi witnesses

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(C) Continuing Duty to Disclose. If prior to or during trial a party learns of an additional witness whose identity, if known, should have been included in the information furnished under subdivision (b)(1)(A) or (B), that party shall promptly notify the adverse party or its attorney of the existence and identity of the additional witness.

(D) Failure to Comply. Upon the failure of either party to comply with the requirements of this rule, the judge may exclude the testimony of any undisclosed witness offered by such party as to the defendant's absence from or presence at the scene of the alleged offense. This rule shall not limit the right of the defendant to testify.

(E) Exceptions. For cause shown, the judge may grant an exception to any of the requirements of subdivisions (b)(1)(A) through (D) of this rule.

(F) Inadmissibility of Withdrawn Alibi. Evidence of an intention to rely upon an alibi defense, later withdrawn, or of statements made in connection with that intention, is not admissible in any civil or criminal proceeding against the person who gave notice of that intention.

(2) Defense of Lack of Criminal Responsibility Because of Mental Disease or Defect.

(A) Notice. If a defendant intends to rely upon the defense of lack of criminal responsibility because of mental disease or defect at the time of the alleged crime, the defendant shall, within the time provided for the filing of pretrial motions by Rule 13(d)(2) or at such later time as the judge may allow, notify the prosecutor in writing of such intention. The notice shall state:

(i) whether the defendant intends to offer testimony of expert witnesses on the issue of lack of criminal responsibility because of mental disease or defect;

(ii) the names and addresses of expert witnesses whom the defendant expects to call; and

(iii) whether those expert witnesses intend to rely in whole or in part on statements of the defendant as to his or her mental condition at the time of the alleged crime or criminal responsibility for the alleged crime.

The defendant shall file a copy of the notice with the clerk. The judge may for cause shown allow late filing of the notice, grant additional time to the parties to prepare for trial, or make such other order as may be appropriate.

(B) Examination. If the notice of the defendant or subsequent inquiry by the judge or developments in the case indicate that statements of the defendant as to his or her mental condition at the time of, or criminal responsibility for, the alleged crime will be relied upon by expert witnesses of the defendant, the court, upon its own motion or upon motion of the prosecutor, may order the defendant to submit to a psychiatric examination consistent with the provisions of the General Laws and subject to the following terms and conditions:

(i) The examination shall include such physical and psychological examinations and physiological and psychiatric tests as the examiner deems necessary to form an opinion as to the mental condition of the defendant at the time the alleged offense was committed. No examination based on statements of the defendant may be conducted unless the court has found that (a) the defendant then intends to offer at trial psychiatric evidence based on his or her own statements or (b) there is a reasonable likelihood that the defendant will offer that evidence.

(ii) No statement, confession, or admission, or other evidence of or obtained from the defendant during the course of the examination, except evidence derived solely from physical or physiological observations or tests, may be revealed to the prosecution or anyone acting on its behalf unless so ordered by the judge

.
(iii) The examiner shall file with the court a written psychiatric report which shall contain his or her findings, including specific statements of the basis thereof, as to the mental condition of the defendant at the time the alleged offense was committed. The report shall be sealed and shall not be made available to the parties unless (a) the judge determines that the report contains no matter, information, or evidence which is based upon statements of the defendant as to his or her mental condition at the time of, or criminal responsibility for, the alleged crime, or which is otherwise within the scope of the privilege against self-incrimination; or (b) the defendant files a motion requesting that the report be made available to the parties; or (c) during trial the defendant raises the defense of lack of criminal responsibility and the judge is satisfied that (1) the defendant intends to testify or (2) the defendant intends to offer expert testimony based in whole or in part upon statements of the defendant as to his or her mental condition at the time of, or criminal responsibility for, the alleged crime.

If a psychiatric report contains both privileged and nonprivileged matter, the court may, if feasible at such time as it deems appropriate, make available to the parties the nonprivileged portions.

(iv) If a defendant refuses to submit to an examination ordered pursuant to and subject to the terms and conditions of this rule, the court may prescribe such remedies as it deems warranted by the circumstances, which may include exclusion of the testimony of any expert witness offered by the defense on the issue of the defendant's mental condition or the admission of evidence of the refusal of the defendant to submit to examination.

(3) Notice of Other Defenses. If a defendant intends to rely upon a defense based upon a license, claim of authority or ownership, or exemption, the defendant shall, within the time provided for the filing of pretrial motions by Rule 13(d)(2) or at such later time as the judge may direct, notify the prosecutor in writing of such intention and file a copy of such notice with the clerk. If there is a failure to comply with the requirements of this subdivision, a license, claim of authority or ownership, or exemption may not be relied upon as a defense. The judge may for cause shown allow a late filing of the notice or grant additional time to the parties to prepare for trial or make such other order as may be appropriate.

(c) Sanctions for Noncompliance.

(1) Relief for Nondisclosure. For failure to comply with any discovery order issued or imposed pursuant to this rule, the court may make a further order for discovery, grant a continuance, or enter such other order as it deems just under the circumstances.

(2) Exclusion of Evidence. The court may in its discretion exclude evidence for noncompliance with a discovery order issued or imposed pursuant to this rule. Testimony of the defendant and evidence concerning the defense of lack of criminal responsibility which is otherwise admissible cannot be excluded except as provided by subdivision (b)(2) of this rule.

(d) Definition. The term "statement", as used in this rule, means:

(1) a writing made by a person having percipient knowledge of relevant facts and which contains such facts, other than drafts or notes that have been incorporated into a subsequent draft or final report; or

(2) a written, stenographic, mechanical, electrical, or other recording, or transcription thereof, which is a substantially verbatim recital of an oral declaration and which is recorded contemporaneously with the making of the oral declaration.

 

[Scooterdog]

Well, I got my mailing from the court clerk. Except I have no idea what it is. I asked her for a Motion for Discovery form. Instead she sent me a form called a: Motion To The Court And Affidavit. It includes check boxes to request certain actions including: Continuance, Remove Default, Remove Dismissal, Speedy Trial, New Trial, Revise or Revoke Sentence, Amend or Extend an Abuse Prevention Order, Withdraw From Representation or Other. None of these obviously cover my request for a Motion For Discovery except maybe "Other". But if it were "Other" then why even tell me that there is such a form when clearly there isn't. "Other" does not constitute a form in my opinion.

You may want to check "continuance" to prepair for your defense and "consult with an lawyer "

 

[Scooterdog]

Oh look modern discovery rules generally provide documents discovered between party's as soon as the action is commenced. In your state it appears no court order is needed.
Simply ask the opposing party for access to the documents or things that you to investigate. Any document that is relevant not privileged and within control of the party may be discovered. You don't have to make a motion just walk into whoever is prosecuting this,and ask to review it. I was looking at scooterdogs post thinking it was an actual motion.

Mass. law say's different. Do you honestly believe, that you could simply walk into a prosecutors office and get what you want?? Please!

Problem 1: Prosecutor isn't supposed to talk to you. Even if one was willing, you'd be a fool to talk to the prosecutor.

Problem 2: How the hell are you going to prove that the prosecutor is withholding discovery, if you NEVER FILE IT? You can't, it will come down to your word against his. Not to hard to figuer out who's side the judge will take.

Problem 3: This whole theory is dead wrong. Why are you telling legalyconfused to do every thing WRONG? Mass. law provides:

Rule 13. PRETRIAL MOTIONS

"(1) Discovery Motions. All pending discovery motions shall be heard and decided prior to the defendant's election of a jury or jury-waived trial. Any discovery matters pending at the time of the pretrial hearing or the compliance hearing shall be heard at that hearing. Discovery motions filed pursuant to subdivision (d)(1) after the defendant's election shall be heard and decided expeditiously.

 

[Green_Hornet]

Do you honestly believe, that you could simply walk into a prosecutors office and get what you want?? Please!

Yes if your going Pro se on a speeding ticket like the poster. If you have an attorney no,he just picks up the phone. The spam you threw up does not change that. Read your own post wise guy.

Rule 14 1(A)Automatic Discovery:
Mandatory Discovery for the Defendant. The prosecution shall disclose to the defense, and permit the defense to discover, inspect and copy, each of the following items and information at or prior to the pretrial conference, provided it is relevant to the case and is in the possession, custody or control of the prosecutor, persons under the prosecutor's direction and control, or persons who have participated in investigating or evaluating the case and either regularly report to the prosecutor's office or have done so in the case:.....

Where does it say you have to file a motion for automatic discovery?

 

[Scooterdog]

Rule 13. PRETRIAL MOTIONS

"(1) Discovery Motions. All pending discovery motions shall be heard and decided prior to the defendant's election of a jury or jury-waived trial. Any discovery matters pending at the time of the pretrial hearing or the compliance hearing shall be heard at that hearing. Discovery motions filed pursuant to subdivision (d)(1) after the defendant's election shall be heard and decided expeditiously.

You may want to take a law class to see how this actually works.

Hey legalyconfused, did that prosecutor come a running with documents yet?? I doubt it. Your on the right track, file your motion for discovery. IF you don't file it with the court, you will have no proof of what the prosecutor did/didn't give you.

If you file your motion with the court, it's on record. For whatever reason, greenhornet is trying to cost you this case. BS!

YOu can call it a "Motion for Discovery" or "Request for Discovery". Your state appears to be a motion. Don't fall for this "mandatory" crap! If you don't do it right, the judge will side with the prosecutor.

 

[Green_Hornet]

This is a speeding ticket,not the Scopes trial. Poster contact the city attorney office tell them you would like all discoverable material prior to your Court date,that you are representing your self. There will more than like be any further discovery requiring motions before trial. It appears from the link if it is non criminal the rules of evidence are relaxed.

The rules of evidence shall not apply at such hearings. The evidence shall be given such weight as the judge or clerk-magistrate deems appropriate. Questioning and cross-examination of witnesses shall proceed to the extent and in the manner determined appropriate by the judge or clerk-magistrate, provided, however, that a party shall not be denied the opportunity to present relevant evidence or cross-examine witnesses.

I know that Judges hate lawyers quibbling over discovery,it's considered unprofessional. Rule 14 "automatic discovery" makes it clear that discovery does not require motions. My guess is the city attorney can show you the packet on the court date,if you need longer than that to build a defense,ask the judge for a continuance.

 

[Scooterdog]

YES, PUT YOUR TURST INTO THE PUBLIC SERVANT. Read rule 13. I"m guessing greenhornets law/math OPINIONS mean less to nothing in a court of law. As would your argument in court"gee judge, I asked for it" Pros-"gee judge, he had everything".

GH, enough is enough. You have repeatedly recomended that this person give up his rights. You question opinions on here after a post like this? Please.

Have you looked at the minimal that will happen when this person doesn't get all of the record? No. Have you ever considered that a public servant would lie? No.

YOu do nothing in court without it being in the record, anything less is incompetence.

 

[Scooterdog]

This is a speeding ticket,not the Scopes trial. Poster contact the city attorney office tell them you would like all discoverable material prior to your Court date,that you are representing your self. There will more than like be any further discovery requiring motions before trial. It appears from the link if it is non criminal the rules of evidence are relaxed.


I know that Judges hate lawyers quibbling over discovery,it's considered unprofessional.[B] Rule 14 [/B]"automatic discovery" makes it clear that discovery does not require motions. My guess is the city attorney can show you the packet on the court date,if you need longer than that to build a defense,ask the judge for a continuance.

Please list the courts you have been in, and what cases. You wouldn't even know what hit you if I had discovery.

 

[Scooterdog]

Well, I got my mailing from the court clerk. Except I have no idea what it is. I asked her for a Motion for Discovery form. Instead she sent me a form called a: Motion To The Court And Affidavit. It includes check boxes to request certain actions including: Continuance, Remove Default, Remove Dismissal, Speedy Trial, New Trial, Revise or Revoke Sentence, Amend or Extend an Abuse Prevention Order, Withdraw From Representation or Other. None of these obviously cover my request for a Motion For Discovery except maybe "Other". But if it were "Other" then why even tell me that there is such a form when clearly there isn't. "Other" does not constitute a form in my opinion.

This can't be right, according to GH, the clerk of court knows what you need, when you need it.

I wonder if GH isn't a mere clerk of "court". :dunno:

 

[Green_Hornet]

Since you did not follow the link I will try it again.
http://www.lawlib.state.ma.us/mvruleb.html

All witnesses shall be placed under oath. The rules of evidence shall not apply at such hearings. The evidence shall be given such weight as the judge or clerk-magistrate deems appropriate. Questioning and cross-examination of witnesses shall proceed to the extent and in the manner determined appropriate by the judge or clerk-magistrate, provided, however, that a party shall not be denied the opportunity to present relevant evidence or cross-examine witnesses.

Hearings on civil motor vehicle infractions shall not be delayed or postponed except for good and sufficient reason.

 

[Green_Hornet]

YES, PUT YOUR TURST INTO THE PUBLIC SERVANT. Read rule 13. I"m guessing greenhornets law/math OPINIONS mean less to nothing in a court of law. As would your argument in court"gee judge, I asked for it" Pros-"gee judge, he had everything".

GH, enough is enough. You have repeatedly recomended that this person give up his rights. You question opinions on here after a post like this? Please.

Have you looked at the minimal that will happen when this person doesn't get all of the record? No. Have you ever considered that a public servant would lie? No.

YOu do nothing in court without it being in the record, anything less is incompetence.

Rule 13 deals with motions, Rule 14 deals with discovery,neither one apply actually. Your right I took it at face value that you had some clue when you posted. The rules you put up are Massachusetts Rules of Criminal Procedure. They do not apply in traffic court for speeding tickets which is a non-criminal hearing . Trust me I wont make that mistake again Spamerdog. I would take the word of a court clerk over some guy on the Internet (a non-lawyer) claiming to be an Original Law Army General (Joke) in a heartbeat. Also next time link to the court rules instead of cutting,and pasting a discovery motion that is not relevant. See the little globe that says insert link its your friend.

 

[Scooterdog]

I believe the starter of the thread already told you the clerk was of no help. Also, this thread started out about a discovery form, which I provided an example of how one could go about it. (I believe I showed two examples).

GH may be right about the ticket being non-criminal. But, I wasn't asked to look up the ticket, only to give an example of a motion to discovery, which an incompetent clerk of court couldn't provide for the individual when asked.

My state, the hearings are true criminal hearings, jury and all.

You can go to the clerk of court, and demand the local rules of the court(these are the rules you will want to follow).

Also next time link to the court rules instead of cutting,and pasting a discovery motion that is not relevant.

My motions don't come from the internet, so I can't provide the link. And it was relevant to the question of what a motion looks like.

As far as posting links goes, I'm not allowed to do that. Any idiot can "provide a link". The fact that when you post the relevant law, others may learn by reading the thread, instead of having to do legal research.

 

[Green_Hornet]

I believe the starter of the thread already told you the clerk was of no help. Also, this thread started out about a discovery form, which I provided an example of how one could go about it. (I believe I showed two examples).

This turned out to be irrelevant given the posters situation. You read what you wanted to and assumed that a motion had to be filed for discovery (for a traffic infraction). You also wrongfully assumed you knew more than the court clerk. As you can see that is not the case.

GH may be right about the ticket being non-criminal. But, I wasn't asked to look up the ticket, only to give an example of a motion to discovery, which an incompetent clerk of court couldn't provide for the individual when asked.

OK so the blind lead the blind, the right answer is you don't have to file a motion for discovery it is automatic, however a non-criminal traffic infraction there is little if any discovery depending on the magistrate. You railed that the clerk can not give legal advice, when in fact a motion for discovery in a non-criminal traffic infraction does not require a motion for discovery. The clerk can not just make up a form that does not exist or give the recipient a form not relevant to the proceeding. The posters post had to do with a traffic infraction, he misunderstood from some where that he is required to submit a motion for discovery. The poster was obviously misinformed by whomever. Spamerdogs post only further confused the issue.

My state, the hearings are true criminal hearings, jury and all.

For non-criminal traffic offenses? What state is that?

My motions don't come from the Internet, so I can't provide the link. And it was relevant to the question of what a motion looks like.

If you were as sharp as you are beating your chest about you would have provided the correct answer to begin with. Since the motion is not relevant why post a sample?

As far as posting links goes, I'm not allowed to do that. Any idiot can "provide a link". The fact that when you post the relevant law, others may learn by reading the thread, instead of having to do legal research.

You're not allowed to why? Any idiot can read them as well, now in all honesty, which is more user friendly the link I posted or the case with a motion presented to the court which you cut, and pasted? The cut paste job you did required considerably more research than the link provided. You could have cut the applicable rule from the site as well. That would have still been shorter than the 4 pages that you pasted. Bottom line the law you posted was irrelevant to the posters situation, so you posted irrelevant law.

You think you know more about the law than the court clerk, well that's not the case, then you think you know more about the law than the hornet, and that DEFINITELY is not the case. In the future don't be so caviler, and condescending with the Green hornet unless you want to get stung again Spammerdog.
Posters contact the city attorney, and tell whoever is handling this case you want to review the folder prior to trial. My guess would be they will tell you can review it on the day of the trial.

 

[Scooterdog]

I guess thats why I've never lost a case. You don't even know how to make the record, which you have shown throughout your posts.

Any one stupid enough to listen to someone telling them to go and talk to a prosecutor should lose a case. You never talk to the prosecutor, and in Montana, they wouldn't talk to you even if you wanted. (They won't even take your phone call)

Green hornets ignorance on the subject of Discovery is crystal clear. Alot of help it would be to see evidence the day of the trial. What a joke. How are you going to get interrogatories if you don't file for discovery?

I would simply default the prosecutor and be done with it.

 

[Green_Hornet]

I guess thats why I've never lost a case. You don't even know how to make the record, which you have shown throughout your posts.

Any one stupid enough to listen to someone telling them to go and talk to a prosecutor should lose a case. You never talk to the prosecutor, and in Montana, they wouldn't talk to you even if you wanted. (They won't even take your phone call)

Green hornets ignorance on the subject of Discovery is crystal clear. Alot of help it would be to see evidence the day of the trial. What a joke. How are you going to get interrogatories if you don't file for discovery?

I would simply default the prosecutor and be done with it.

Are you a practicing attorney? NOPE so what are all these case are you talking about that you won ? Look Billy Jack this posters from the big town. How much evidence do you think there is on a non criminal traffic infraction? Not much more than is written on the ticket.
Less reading than your 4 pages of spam,and a whole lot easier to understand. Poster Spammerdog is not an attorney. You take his post to an attorney in your state that handles traffic infractions. He will get a good laugh,and then tell you what to do.

 

[Scooterdog]

we don't have traffic infractions. No lawyer in my state has ever won a case against me, sorry. Child custody, won in less than a half hour. Chief of police resigned within a half hour of a court case against me, thus the city did away with the police department. Only have a sheriff's department. Have never lost to debt collector, even on bad checks.

Hit and run case, had it thrown out of court. Back tax land, forced sale-removed from stupid, incomptent lower life form judge, into State District Court, awaiting Judge Hegel to throw out case.

Never lost a traffic case.

And what have you don't GH? Nothing? Ya, I thought so. You seem to be a lowlife government employee. God I would have a hay-day in a court room with you. Your ingnorance of legal procedure bolsters your incompetence even further.

 

[Green_Hornet]

we don't have traffic infractions. No lawyer in my state has ever won a case against me, sorry. Child custody, won in less than a half hour. Chief of police resigned within a half hour of a court case against me, thus the city did away with the police department. Only have a sheriff's department. Have never lost to debt collector, even on bad checks.

Hit and run case, had it thrown out of court. Back tax land, forced sale-removed from stupid, incomptent lower life form judge, into State District Court, awaiting Judge Hegel to throw out case.

Never lost a traffic case.

And what have you don't GH? Nothing? Ya, I thought so. You seem to be a lowlife government employee. God I would have a hay-day in a court room with you. Your ingnorance of legal procedure bolsters your incompetence even further.

Ha Ha Haa your quite a piece of work. You would never have your day in court with me for one very important reason. YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO PRACTICE LAW. YOU ARE NOT A LAWYER. YOU ARE A NUT!

 

[Scooterdog]

No gh, you are the "nut", the little loser telling people crap like "talk to the prosecutor, they will help". That is almost criminal.

I never said or insinuated I was a lawyer. Again, why would I? I have never lost to a lawyer, and my cases actually make the paper.

Again, a public servant trying to post dissinformation about law. Can't rebut it, so the loser call's me a nut. LOL, that rich.

 

[Green_Hornet]

No gh, you are the "nut", the little loser telling people crap like "talk to the prosecutor, they will help". That is almost criminal.

I never said or insinuated I was a lawyer. Again, why would I? I have never lost to a lawyer, and my cases actually make the paper.

Again, a public servant trying to post dissinformation about law. Can't rebut it, so the loser call's me a nut. LOL, that rich.

Sorry bud already handed you your ass on this post,my work here is done. One other thing if the poster retains an attorney who do you think will be the first person his attorney will call? Just shout it out when you know the answer.

 

[Scooterdog]

Sorry bud already handed you your ass on this post,my work here is done. One other thing if the poster retains an attorney who do you think will be the first person his attorney will call? Just shout it out when you know the answer.

What ever loser. I would never call a lawyer, only two people need lawyers, Underage persons and incompetent. I say gh would fall under "incompetent".