Does the postmistress of a small rural town have the power to refuse to provide someone their mail ?

[get2rhino]

Jurisdiction

Arizona

In Yucca, Arizona, a friend of mine has been told point blank by the postmistress that she won't give him his own mail. I feel fairly sure that she can't legally do this based on personality conflict or personal dislike.
Unlike a private business which can refuse to serve someone, the U.S. Post Office as a public agency of the U.S. Federal government would be mandated to provide service to the public, unless there existed some specific exigent circumstance regarding the safety of the public, or the staff of the post office, I should think.

 

[army judge]

In Yucca, Arizona, a friend of mine has been told point blank by the postmistress that she won't give him his own mail. I feel fairly sure that she can't legally do this based on personality conflict or personal dislike.
Unlike a private business which can refuse to serve someone, the U.S. Post Office as a public agency of the U.S. Federal government would be mandated to provide service to the public, unless there existed some specific exigent circumstance regarding the safety of the public, or the staff of the post office, I should think.

Was your friend given a reason when HE asked the postmistress about this?

You have no standing in this matter.

This is for your friend to fix.

He should ask in writing.
Copies should be sent to his congressman, and two US Senators.
He should ask his elected officials to inquire on his behalf.

 

[adjusterjack]

In Yucca, Arizona, a friend of mine has been told point blank by the postmistress that she won't give him his own mail. I feel fairly sure that she can't legally do this based on personality conflict or personal dislike.

Is that really what's happening? Or is there more to the story than you are telling? How about having your friend come here to answer questions about what's happening rather than give it to us second hand in a manner designed to evoke sympathy?

 

[get2rhino]

Is that really what's happening? Or is there more to the story than you are telling? How about having your friend come here to answer questions about what's happening rather than give it to us second hand in a manner designed to evoke sympathy?

Well that's quite the blunt not very polte way of implying that I'm a liar.
But that's just it. I'm not. Nor do I know what is actually going on, other than what my friend has asserted to me, but I can say that he is extremely intelligent, and is so scathingly accurate in his factual reporting that he is probably the closest thing to an unimpeachable data source that it is possible for a human being to be. So much so, that I tend to regard anything that he tells me as flatly factual for the credibility he has earned with me over the few years I have known him. Add to this the fact that he is the single most incisive, capable, and effective problem solver I've ever met. His request for me was actually to search for a legal precedent which might afford him some solution to his problem. Some have called me a wannabe attorney, which I certainly am NOT. I happen to have an extremely low opinion of attorneys having met more of them than I NEVER wanted to know during my 10 year unwiling immersion education in the application of law at the local level having made over 400 court appearances during that time in our family's juvenile court case in California. Most of us have heard it asserted that justice is blind, but I have found that she's also deaf, psychopathic, extremely mentally and ethically challenged, mean as a snake with s broken back, utterly devoid of empathy AND (this last asserted BY attorney Ron Serna of El Centro, CA who said yes when asked by me if I may attribute this quote to him) A PROSTITUTE ON TOP OF THAT, because she only puts out for those who have MONEY. There are some in our world who tell the truth, but lawyers are not them. And sadly, the fact that 97% of our country's lawmakers are lawyers simply inspires NO confidence whatsoever. The first time I heard Don Henley's song "In the garden of Allah" it sent chills up the back of my neck and It became evident to me that Mr. Henley had met a lawyer or two in his day. Court is a dog and pony show. As far as designing a manner which might evoke sympathy? You are clearly unable to see the forest for the trees. He certainly does not need or want sympathy from one as arrogant as you sir. You seem to think you are trying him for something. The question asked was, "Can a functionary of the U.S Post Office (Postmistress/Postmaster) refuse to give someone their mail?"

 

[d1amund]

I have no idea if that novella above included anything useful, tl;dr as the kids say these days, but maybe have the friend read this:
The Postal Service and Its Obligation | USPS Office of Inspector General

 

[adjusterjack]

Well that's quite the blunt not very polte way of implying that I'm a liar.

Wasn't implying that at all.

Nor do I know what is actually going on

Exactly my point.

other than what my friend has asserted to me

Of which you have told us precious little.

The question asked was, "Can a functionary of the U.S Post Office (Postmistress/Postmaster) refuse to give someone their mail?"

That question can only be answered "yes" in the abstract, but that wasn't the question. In fact, there was no question originally.

You wrote:

In Yucca, Arizona, a friend of mine has been told point blank by the postmistress that she won't give him his own mail. I feel fairly sure that she can't legally do this based on personality conflict or personal dislike.
Unlike a private business which can refuse to serve someone, the U.S. Post Office as a public agency of the U.S. Federal government would be mandated to provide service to the public, unless there existed some specific exigent circumstance regarding the safety of the public, or the staff of the post office, I should think.

And gave no details about the "personality conflict or personal dislike."

Coming back with a rant instead of information about what's happening wasn't helpful.

If neither you nor your friend is willing to provide appropriate details here, he has the option of filing a written complaint with the appropriate postal authorities.

 

[Betty3]

What is she doing with his mail?

 

[get2rhino]

I have no idea if that novella above included anything useful, tl;dr as the kids say these days, but maybe have the friend read this:
The Postal Service and Its Obligation | USPS Office of Inspector General

I will have the friend read the referenced document. As far as the novella goes, sorry. I would like to interject however that I have met and experienced personally

What is she doing with his mail?

What is she doing with his mail?

I had not inquired about what she is doing with his mail. However the suggestion from the army judge is well taken on my part. I do understand that it is an issue involving my friend and needs to be resolved BY him (and to that end, I have forwarded a copy of the email with the link to the discussion thread that he might jump in there and clarify, thus removing third party potential to confuse regarding a possibly misunderstood issue, and it is my hope that he will do so) Issues of concern on my part are for instance: It is against the law to carry a recording device in any federal building. The implications of this are frightening to consider and especially in light of recent information regarding the provision of hollow point bullets to federal employees such as Social Security and the IRS (presumably the postal supervisors have been packing heat for WAY TOO LONG already, and have perhaps become "too big for their breeches" as my hundred year old grandmother says.)

 

[joelia]

Hi there. I am an attorney. I can appreciate the fact that others feel that we are reviled. But we usually do operate under the assumption that logic is a very important part of understanding the facts. And motivation is an important fact to be determined.

I am understanding of @adjusterjack and his point of view, which is that the most important issue was not mentioned and which probably would have been the first question any lawyer would ask - why isn't the US Post Officer employee withholding your mail? I'm sure the employee knows the rules. The need will probably be to attack the basis upon which the US Post Office employee is using for withholding the mail. And while I will take you at your word that your friend might be someone you hold in high regard, it's clearly critical to know how and why someone who seems so upstanding could have made a federal employee so irate so as to withhold mail. Good luck.

 

[get2rhino]

Hi there. I am an attorney. I can appreciate the fact that others feel that we are reviled. But we usually do operate under the assumption that logic is a very important part of understanding the facts. And motivation is an important fact to be determined.

I am understanding of @adjusterjack and his point of view, which is that the most important issue was not mentioned and which probably would have been the first question any lawyer would ask - why isn't the US Post Officer employee withholding your mail? I'm sure the employee knows the rules. The need will probably be to attack the basis upon which the US Post Office employee is using for withholding the mail. And while I will take you at your word that your friend might be someone you hold in high regard, it's clearly critical to know how and why someone who seems so upstanding could have made a federal employee so irate so as to withhold mail. Good luck.

I do apologize counselor for my extreme biases given my subjective experience of the legal system. People should never be painted with a broad brush in groups because they are individuals, and so I find myself guilty of the same crime that I accuse the legal system of (and it is the legal system which is guilty of not adjudicating each individual case on it's individual merit and circumstances) because I must say that I have met a few attorneys personally who are heroes because of the fact that they have stepped up to the higher priority definition of themselves in the descending hierarchy of definition: Human being first. I think that there is a reason that mediation is becoming SO popular a trend. Career judges are an unpleasant concept, and you know you've been in the grinder a long time when you've watched the judges come up from kindergarten. I find it interesting to note that the quality I hold against one judge most is the very same quality I hold against another. Compassion. It's something we are seeing less of in every aspect of the legal system (and the unfortunate transition from protecting and serving of peace officers to Law Enforcement, where one is required to take ones human being suit no further than the station locker room. But better yet is to leave it at home. Some of the substantial details to emerge from my friends story are that the single greatest point of contention is his lack of documentation to satisfy her official need to identify him positively. And probably the fact that they knew one another from school attended 3,000
miles away where both grew up, and didn't like each other then. Now there is a position of authority which allows one to show the other who is boss. My friend can be very annoying, (in fact infuriating) in his attempts to justify controlling behavior. And I have not met the Postmistress in Yucca AZ yet, but expect that I will directly as we are moving there in next few days in order to get out of the cities before the whole house of cards falls in. This has just been another day wasted of many. I'm back quiet embarrassed and chagrined. I'd like to thank the person who sent the link about the Obligations of the postal service and am sorry if I insulted anyone.

 

[get2rhino]

Hi there. I am an attorney. I can appreciate the fact that others feel that we are reviled. But we usually do operate under the assumption that logic is a very important part of understanding the facts. And motivation is an important fact to be determined.

I am understanding of @adjusterjack and his point of view, which is that the most important issue was not mentioned and which probably would have been the first question any lawyer would ask - why isn't the US Post Officer employee withholding your mail? I'm sure the employee knows the rules. The need will probably be to attack the basis upon which the US Post Office employee is using for withholding the mail. And while I will take you at your word that your friend might be someone you hold in high regard, it's clearly critical to know how and why someone who seems so upstanding could have made a federal employee so irate so as to withhold mail. Good luck.

And thank you joelia. One of my favorite movies of all time is Regarding Henry with Harrison Ford = D

 

[adjusterjack]

I have not met the Postmistress in Yucca AZ yet,

Yucca, AZ is a small town in northwestern AZ, located along I-40, hardly a grain of sand in the AZ desert. Population listed at 126, down from almost 300 in the year 2000.

Given the smallness of the community, I'll grant you the possibility that something personal may be an issue between your friend and the postmistress.

If she is withholding your friend's mail (or threatening to - not clear, yet) for personal reasons, that's obviously going to violate postal regulations and the terms of her employment (don't have to read them to figure that out) and might subject her to disciplinary action or even termination of employment (doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out).

However, with no details about what happened or is happening, that's about all anybody can say.

 

[get2rhino]

Yucca, AZ is a small town in northwestern AZ, located along I-40, hardly a grain of sand in the AZ desert. Population listed at 126, down from almost 300 in the year 2000.

Given the smallness of the community, I'll grant you the possibility that something personal may be an issue between your friend and the postmistress.

If she is withholding your friend's mail (or threatening to - not clear, yet) for personal reasons, that's obviously going to violate postal regulations and the terms of her employment (don't have to read them to figure that out) and might subject her to disciplinary action or even termination of employment (doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out).

However, with no details about what happened or is happening, that's about all anybody can say.

Thanks much adjusterjack, I apologize for my unfocused rant, I do have severe adult ADHD (probably doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure that out either)
We can't all be rocket scientists, but my friend IS (and then some)
He's kind of like the Forrest Gump fictional character, but backwards. To say that the world revolves around him may be a bit of an understatement, he's SO brilliant it's nearly beyond belief, has had to do with many of our worlds scientific and technological achievements, and no one will ever know his name.
But Mr. Personality he AIN'T. He tends to be perceived as arrogant, condescending, abraisive, obnoxious and is generally maddening to deal with (he admits to being obnoxious but seldom intends to be. A trait we share) Yet this man, who is incredibly resourceful beyond belief, is a solid contributor to the world he lives in, asks nothing from anyone, seeks not wealth, or fame, no recognition of any worldly kind. My wife and I love him (most of the time) and I'm officially backing out of this forum discussion thread (wish I'd discovered this site while my family was being crushed needledsly to death. But it has been said, "When the student is ready the teacher will appear.") I've advised my friend to stick with more productive persuits than banging his head against the postmistress head at a Post Office branch which it would seem is LONG overdue to be closed, following suit with the Social Security offices which offices, hours of operation, and services have been greatly redacted. Makes one wonder what insidious purpose is served by USPS besides mail delivery. Maybe the millions of rounds of hollow point bullets issued by the fake hijacked federal government are because other agencies are deliberately being driven " postal".
Sorry for not using the site correctly, and for wasting anyone's time. Thanks, Love and light, Craig Alcott, Advocate for the Disabled since 1992 aka Rhino. ; )

 

[adjusterjack]

And, still, no details about what is happening.

Sigh.

 

[d1amund]

And, still, no details about what is happening.

Sigh.

Coming soon...keep an eye out for another novella; it may be hidden within there

 

[army judge]

Well, at least this person offered an apology.
If that's the end of the matter, as far as the poster s concerned, I accept that as fact.
Thank you, OP, for publicly acknowledging your temporary loss of civility and apologizing.

I wasn't offended, but respect your apology.

 

[ElleMD]

Has it not occurred to your supposedly intelligent friend to call the postal service and report not receiving mail? Seems that would be much more productive than having 3rd parties rant about conspiracy theories and lawyer bash online.

 

[get2rhino]

What is she doing with his mail?

Hi y'all! My friend has addressed the issue of the withhold of his mail, in writing some time ago,reason given him was insufficient identification documentation (having mentioned a personal dislike issue from 3000 miles away and many years ago, so it is clear to ME that this is 2 power tripping control freak people banging heads) My friend mentioned yesterday that he won the long-standing war (although I suspect that one, or more of you kind and helpful people whose impetus is to help others with the knowledge gained from many years in positions of authority whispering to a little birdy.....and if so thanks much. I'm not into wars of any kind, but rather communications which facilitates benefit to all of us as the family of humanity on Earth, the 3rd dirtball out from the big ball of fire) Sorry for the ranting. Nice to have "met" all you helpful people. Law is ostensibly there to protect people. Glad my wife led me on this stumble across you. I'll be back soon ; )

 

[get2rhino]

Hi there. I am an attorney. I can appreciate the fact that others feel that we are reviled. But we usually do operate under the assumption that logic is a very important part of understanding the facts. And motivation is an important fact to be determined.

I am understanding of @adjusterjack and his point of view, which is that the most important issue was not mentioned and which probably would have been the first question any lawyer would ask - why isn't the US Post Officer employee withholding your mail? I'm sure the employee knows the rules. The need will probably be to attack the basis upon which the US Post Office employee is using for withholding the mail. And while I will take you at your word that your friend might be someone you hold in high regard, it's clearly critical to know how and why someone who seems so upstanding could have made a federal employee so irate so as to withhold mail. Good luck.

Hi Joella. I do apologize for the generic lawyer slamming. One does hesitate to paint with a broad brush, (some have called me a "wannabe attorney" which I am not.) I did want to mention, however, that although I've met and dealt with more attorneys than I NEVER wanted to know, I've met some really heroic stand up types (numbering far in the minority, but still) Abe Lincoln and I say much the same thing about lawyer business (except that HE was a lawyer, and U.S. President) Don't forget to read, Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars it's a doozy.
Thank you all for your help.